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 Who won the Clone Wars?

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Darth Romana
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PostSubject: Who won the Clone Wars?   Sun Nov 07, 2010 7:48 pm

Okay clearly we all know that the Galactic Republic and its sucsessor government the Galactic Empire won the Clone Wars how ever to characters from opposing sides on the conflict in RotS said the line "the war is over in a slightly favourable tone" - they are of course Bail Organa and Nute Gunray.

What I don't under stand is from the perspective we see the Republic has clearly not lost since Coruscant is still Republic controled and the Senate and the Chansalor/Emperor maintain power how ever Nute Gunray (an intelligent individual) says to Darth Vader "The War is over. Darth Sidious... promised us peace" he could not have possibly thought the CIS had won, but neither could he have thought they had lost or else he would have ether fled into exile or would have been fearing iminant arrest.

Also Darth Sidious informs the CIS council that the War is over yet none of them (again) question or refer to its victor. At this point (as with every point) the CIS (as well as the Republic) had no idea of Darth Sidious' duel identy.

What I'm wondering is did the CIS Council think the CIS had won? or lost? Or that the War between the two governments was over and they were going to both exist together in peace.

I think I would favour the 3rd option as nothing mentions the end of the Republic or CIS and he refurs to the promices of peace. What are other peoples thoughts?
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PostSubject: Re: Who won the Clone Wars?   Mon Feb 14, 2011 7:14 pm

Considering the CIS council were one of the few who knew who Sidious was, but not his dual identity, I'd think that when Sidious said the war was over, they assumed that "they", the Sith's allies, had won the war. Of course, to no offense towards Romana, such a question is moot considering that they died. Whether or not we know if they all thought they were betrayed by Sidious may never be known. Though Gunray alluded to the fact that he believed that Sidious did, in fact, betray them.
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PostSubject: Re: Who won the Clone Wars?   Mon Feb 14, 2011 7:31 pm

Faxdi Adoug wrote:
Considering the CIS council were one of the few who knew who Sidious was, but not his dual identity, I'd think that when Sidious said the war was over, they assumed that "they", the Sith's allies, had won the war. Of course, to no offense towards Romana, such a question is moot considering that they died. Whether or not we know if they all thought they were betrayed by Sidious may never be known. Though Gunray alluded to the fact that he believed that Sidious did, in fact, betray them.

I was referring to the point before they died, the point of the question what assataing the situation the war was in when Gunray and Bail Organa both said "The war is over", neither knew about their leaders position on the other side of the war so neither had any idea how the war could possibly end. The war didn't end by either sides military might, so I don't consider to the question to be "moot", as such if you look at the swtor forums much of the questions asked are "moot" because they are looking at what might have happened or what could have happened rather than what did happen. (just like the "Jango Fett vs Boba Fett" - that could never have happened, yet that doesn't prevent a disucssion)

The CIS council couldn't possibly have thought that they had won since of late they had suffered allot of great losses such as Count Dooku, General Grevous and much of there fleet at Coruscant. If you look at cases such as 1940 where the French signed an armasist with the Germans, for them the war had ended yet Vitchy France neither surrendered and wasn't occupied. I can only assume that the Republic and CIS both assumed that the war had ended by some sort of armasist or at least a diplomatic solution. Long before either Gunray or Bail Organa said it, Anakin made reference to the fact that killing Greveous would end the war, Sidious then said to Greveous "the end of the war is near" - two Generals seeing that the war is nearly at an end, yet both think their side is to be the victor...
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PostSubject: Re: Who won the Clone Wars?   Mon Feb 14, 2011 7:42 pm

Darth Romana wrote:
Faxdi Adoug wrote:
Considering the CIS council were one of the few who knew who Sidious was, but not his dual identity, I'd think that when Sidious said the war was over, they assumed that "they", the Sith's allies, had won the war. Of course, to no offense towards Romana, such a question is moot considering that they died. Whether or not we know if they all thought they were betrayed by Sidious may never be known. Though Gunray alluded to the fact that he believed that Sidious did, in fact, betray them.

I was referring to the point before they died, the point of the question what assataing the situation the war was in when Gunray and Bail Organa both said "The war is over", neither knew about their leaders position on the other side of the war so neither had any idea how the war could possibly end. The war didn't end by either sides military might, so I don't consider to the question to be "moot", as such if you look at the swtor forums much of the questions asked are "moot" because they are looking at what might have happened or what could have happened rather than what did happen. (just like the "Jango Fett vs Boba Fett" - that could never have happened, yet that doesn't prevent a disucssion)

The CIS council couldn't possibly have thought that they had won since of late they had suffered allot of great losses such as Count Dooku, General Grevous and much of there fleet at Coruscant. If you look at cases such as 1940 where the French signed an armasist with the Germans, for them the war had ended yet Vitchy France neither surrendered and wasn't occupied. I can only assume that the Republic and CIS both assumed that the war had ended by some sort of armasist or at least a diplomatic solution. Long before either Gunray or Bail Organa said it, Anakin made reference to the fact that killing Greveous would end the war, Sidious then said to Greveous "the end of the war is near" - two Generals seeing that the war is nearly at an end, yet both think their side is to be the victor...

That's why I said that the Council believed that ultimately Sidious was or would be victorious and, by proxy, they too had won the war, but not in a military sense. Also you must consider that they had to pretty much trust in Sidious' decision. I didn't mean to offend you Romana.
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PostSubject: Re: Who won the Clone Wars?   Mon Feb 14, 2011 8:26 pm

The looks of it is that the Republic won because of the amount of clones they could produce clone>drone. But in the same sense it looks like that in the end it did not really matter because the Sith killed all the Jedi...
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PostSubject: Re: Who won the Clone Wars?   Today at 5:38 pm

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